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Landing gear - lack of suspension  This thread currently has 3,015 views. Print
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Keith103
November 1, 2018, 2:05am Report to Moderator

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I started taxiing my Max, and came to realize what not having a suspension on the landing gear means. I have kept my main wheel tires inflated less , though I cannot measure whether it is exactly 8 PSI. All my guages read upwards from 10 PSI.

Each bump while taxiing sends a shock up my spine, but worse still, is the horrible noise the whole landing gear makes when impacting bumps. my tail wheel also contributes to the noise level if it impacts a dip or a bump.

Last week-end I trailered the Max to an airfield by name Springs East, which is about 30 miles east of Colorado springs, which has a paved runway. I was all ready to do some fast tail-up taxiing. But when I entered the runway I realized that there are dips of about 3 inches between broken slabs of the pavement on the Runway, and as the Max crossed each of these dips there were two loud noises from the gear - the first one as the main wheels crossed the dip and the second when the tail wheel crossed the dip.

I quickly abandoned any further use of the runway, and did some slow to medium speed taxiing up and down the parallel dirt  taxy way, and eventually returned without having done any productive effort.

I still am not sure how much is too much when it comes to a bump for the Max gear. I don't mind the discomfort, but do not want to break my landing gear. Any thoughts on this will be appreciated.

I am still looking for grass strips around where I live, but so far not been able to find one which accepts ultralights.
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Keith103
November 1, 2018, 2:16am Report to Moderator

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Here is a picture of the R/W from satellite view. All those black lines are what I am talking about.
Those dips may be about 4 to 5 inches in width and about 3 to 4 inches in depth.





Attachment: rw_broken_slabs_4024.jpg
Size: 127.01 KB

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Stilson
November 1, 2018, 2:31am Report to Moderator
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Not an answer but a question, it is hard to tell scale from the pic, but is there a long enough section to run up to speed to take most the weight off the gear before hitting a divot, and another long enough to slow it back down? Kinda old school  barnstormer tactic, roll up some speed, but not enough to jar it, then first smooth spot firewall it to put the weight into the wings, the planes mass combined with the wings lift will let it float over the low spots.
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LSaupe
November 1, 2018, 9:34am Report to Moderator
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That might get ya off, but would landing still be an issue?
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PUFF
November 1, 2018, 11:43am Report to Moderator

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yeah, just get the weight off the gear asap and you can fly. what's the length between the "ditches"? you might be able to use a single slab as a runway if long enough.
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Keith103
November 1, 2018, 3:59pm Report to Moderator

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Thanks for your thoughts on this. The cracks are spaced about 30 to 50 feet apart, so there is no way I can avoid them. Hitting at least 4 of them may be the minimum before my 30 HP engine can haul me away from the surface.  If I had bigger wheels and a pneumatic tail wheel, I could still have manged. Presently my wheel has the base ultralight plastic rim. And the tail wheel is the standard shopping cart variety that came with the kit. The only other plane operating that day was a King-Air which obviously is a monster with much bigger wheels as compared to the puny Max. The King Air made at least about 10 landings in the 4 hours I was at the airfield. It was ferrying the sky divers from the skydiving school up to their jumping altitude.
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ITman496
November 1, 2018, 4:07pm Report to Moderator

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It sounds like you need these  

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The Termite
November 1, 2018, 4:52pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Keith103
I have kept my main wheel tires inflated less , though I cannot measure whether it is exactly 8 PSI. All my gauges read upwards from 10 PSI.

Tractor Supply sells a Slime brand low pressure tire gauge, 1 - 20psi, for $6.99.

https://www.tractorsupply.com/.....xEAQYASABEgKG_fD_BwE


Have you considered getting a few sacks of Sackrete or asphalt filler, and filling/patching some of the cracks?  Enough to give you a smooth T/O and landing zone?

Back when I had my Himax, I kept a 800-900ft strip of the grassy area between the taxiway and the runway mowed short, so I could T/O and land on grass. I never heard any complaints from the manager. I also added two 400 watt metal halide lights to my hanger for more light.  Only requirement was that the wiring had to be in conduit, which I did.

If you want bigger wheels/tires, Asuza has an 8" wheel that accepts 4.8/4 - 8"  tires. That would give you a wheel/tire diameter of about 16 inches.

https://www.amazon.com/Maratho.....Y47D0JF0ZXKSKJRFSQ78

And you can mod the rear spring to accept a bigger tail wheel.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B002.....e8-852c-1fd6a0133398
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Bob Daly
November 1, 2018, 5:20pm Report to Moderator
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What's the condition of 8/26? Can you use the infield?
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Greg Doe
November 1, 2018, 5:42pm Report to Moderator
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+1 on what the Termite said. I got one of the low pressure Slime gauges at a local auto parts store. O'Reilly's I think? The Max landing gear will take a lot of punishment. Because there is no suspension, except for the tires, you feel every bump. Grass would be a better choice for learning if you can find someplace to practice.  
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flydog
November 1, 2018, 11:51pm Report to Moderator
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Hi Keith
When you do your fast tail up taxing on that runway...will you have the wings installed this time?
Have you done a weight and balance yet?
Phil
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Keith103
November 2, 2018, 2:39am Report to Moderator

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Quoted from The Termite

Tractor Supply sells a Slime brand low pressure tire gauge, 1 - 20psi, for $6.99.

https://www.tractorsupply.com/.....xEAQYASABEgKG_fD_BwE


Have you considered getting a few sacks of Sackrete or asphalt filler, and filling/patching some of the cracks?  Enough to give you a smooth T/O and landing zone?

Back when I had my Himax, I kept a 800-900ft strip of the grassy area between the taxiway and the runway mowed short, so I could T/O and land on grass. I never heard any complaints from the manager. I also added two 400 watt metal halide lights to my hanger for more light.  Only requirement was that the wiring had to be in conduit, which I did.

If you want bigger wheels/tires, Asuza has an 8" wheel that accepts 4.8/4 - 8"  tires. That would give you a wheel/tire diameter of about 16 inches.

https://www.amazon.com/Maratho.....Y47D0JF0ZXKSKJRFSQ78

And you can mod the rear spring to accept a bigger tail wheel.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B002.....e8-852c-1fd6a0133398


Termite thanks for some very useful suggestions above. It turns out I had one of those round dial pressure gauges lying in my garage which had markings from 5 PSI upwards. I checked the tires today and they were at 9PSI. So lowering it to 8 PSI will help some.

The other issue with Springs East is it is 105 miles one way from my home in Denver. 210 miles is a long way to trailer for an hour or less of flying time. So my search continues for a closer field. Hard to believe I have already trailered the Max 545 miles in just 2 weeks - all in my open trailer. The trailer is 14 ft long and 6 ft 4 inches wide ( internal ). I have become fairly experienced at tying it down in the trailer , so the plane does not get damaged. But I will save the trailer story for another thread.

Your idea of doing some improvised repair also sounds interesting. I do not think the manager will object to  that. So if I have to go back to that airfield again, then I will explore that idea of some quick-crete patch work.

Today I went and had a quick look at another airfield which is only 65 miles from my home. This is "Easton Valley view" just south of Greeley. ( FAA code 11V). There are two dirt gravel runways, but surprisingly both are in good condition. I drove my SUV all along the runway ( There was no traffic or any activity today ) and the surface was pretty smooth, though winds were gusting at 20 to 25 mph. So if I get a chance before winter sets in when winds are calm, I will visit this place with my Max. I spoke with the Manager on the phone and he was quite welcoming to ultra-lights. So that makes some good progress. I will update after I visit that place with my Max.

Flydog, yes I did attach the wings when I taxied at Springs East the other day, so the plane was at full weight on that day. By the time I set up the wings and got everything ready, the winds started picking up, so I did not do weight and balance yet, instead I headed straight for taxying before the winds get worse. These are really windy places. Both Limon and Springs East have windmill farms not far from the runway, and I was told they erect these wind farms only at statistically and historically windy places. In fact as I have been riding my motor cycle in these states just east of the Rockies, my experience has been that CO, WY, NM, and Kansas are all very windy places. One has to wait patiently for a day when winds are below 10 mph. That has just been my experience with the winds. Other members may like to relate to the wind challenges they face.

Bob Daly, No I did not use the other R/W 8/26 at Springs East, it is not in good condition and is not used. It has big lumps of grass and is probably worse than even the cracked asphalt R/W. It is probably not used by anyone at all. The parallel taxy way ( 17L / 35R ) is sometimes used as a runway, so is slightly better.

Greg Doe, thanks for your input.


Here is a grainy very poor quality video of taxying my Max. This was taken from far away.

https://youtu.be/dX7WHf5pne8
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gyrojeffro
November 2, 2018, 4:12am Report to Moderator
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The design of aircraft suspension isnt so your airplane handles like a cadillac .its to handle high landing loads.
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PUFF
November 2, 2018, 11:43am Report to Moderator

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You can eliminate the tailwheel part by Just tossing the tail in the air first, gain speed and fly the rest.

There's an airbike around here somewhere with a larger pneumatic tire. I've got a picture of the assembly.
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wirsig
November 3, 2018, 3:16am Report to Moderator

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Use the grass at KFLY. It’s west of the runway, where the gliders takeoff and land.
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Keith103
November 3, 2018, 6:26am Report to Moderator

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Quoted from wirsig
Use the grass at KFLY. It’s west of the runway, where the gliders takeoff and land.


I was trying to avoid KFLY because a friend said the airfield is pretty busy. The grass surface is appealing. I will give it a try sometime. Thanks
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kfb
November 9, 2018, 3:23pm Report to Moderator
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Hi
Somewhere recently, and I was sure it was on this site, someone had sent in a photo of Max gear with regular tire and next to that tire was a really neat looking, much larger, balloon tire.  I would like to get the source of the large balloon tire if possible, of course if it wasn't a photo on this site, the inquiry becomes somewhat useless.  Although, I could just throw the question out there, does anyone have a source for significantly larger, balloon type tires/rims that would fit on the original axle set up for a Max?  Thank you very much for your responses.
Kim Brown
New Hampshire
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Bob Hoskins
November 9, 2018, 4:43pm Report to Moderator

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Kieth
When I built my Himax years ago, 3 different tires were available I think. The std was like a wheel barrel tire, a standard rib and then the big "tundra" tire. Maybe David Cooper can help you here. the middle tire I used with my wheel pants.
Bob


Fly safe and have fun.
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wirsig
November 14, 2018, 1:11am Report to Moderator

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Are you thinking of the Carlisle Turf Glide tires? I’m putting a set on an airbike I’m rebuilding. They’re huge compared to the wheelbarrow tires that were on it. Little over 6” wide and 17” tall, Around 8 lbs each. Ordered mine online from WalMart.
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wirsig
November 14, 2018, 2:13am Report to Moderator

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PUFF
November 14, 2018, 12:27pm Report to Moderator

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I'll be waiting on a performance report for those! Anything to get the wheel barrows off mine.
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Stilson
November 14, 2018, 10:03pm Report to Moderator
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Do you have the size numbers on those, I can't zoom in enough to make it out.  I'm very interested in getting a set for bean stubble "runways"
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ulbuilder
November 15, 2018, 4:06am Report to Moderator
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I was able to zoom in and see the part number is 508040
Carlisle Turf Glide Golf Cart Tire - 8.00-6
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B005O5WDOM/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_c.o7BbR1DXFRA
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texasbuzzard
November 15, 2018, 9:53am Report to Moderator

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I had the turf tires on my a/b fo a while and they worked for dampening the landing but they are not true and vibrate the entire a/c after liftoff. Applying brakes eliminated it. These tires were not designed for that rpm.

Monte
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LSaupe
November 15, 2018, 10:11am Report to Moderator
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The Turf Tire Bear offers might be an options as well. 8 x 6

http://www.bearperkins.com/accessories.htm
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gyrojeffro
November 16, 2018, 5:14am Report to Moderator
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Cdl has those huge bicycle wheels. If that's not a bush wheel.then nothing is lol
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gyrojeffro
November 16, 2018, 5:31am Report to Moderator
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I used the plastic azusa wheels but used a rounded tire instead of the gokart tire.makes for a bigger wheel and it looks more like a plane than a gokart
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wirsig
November 17, 2018, 2:47am Report to Moderator

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Carlisle Turf Glide 8.00-6/4 Tire
Average rating:0out of5stars, based on0reviewsWrite a review
CarlisleWalmart # 550462553
$50.97
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Carlisle-Turf-Glide-8-00-6-4-Tire/23597336
https://www.walmart.com/ip/TIR.....Heavy-Duty/891011414
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Keith103
November 21, 2018, 6:28pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from wirsig
Carlisle Turf Glide 8.00-6/4 Tire
Average rating:0out of5stars, based on0reviewsWrite a review
CarlisleWalmart # 550462553
$50.97
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Carlisle-Turf-Glide-8-00-6-4-Tire/23597336
https://www.walmart.com/ip/TIR.....Heavy-Duty/891011414


The tire looks good but will require re-working of axle / struts as width looks more than that of the stock wheel barrow tire.
I guess the above tires are 8.00x 6, where as my stock axle setup is for 4.00 x 6 tire.

--------


This post below is not about suspension, or lack of it.
It is simply my search for a replacement tire. I need a more robust tire than the stock wheel barrow Chinese tire.
(I recently had 3 flats .)

I am looking to upgrade just the tires to a better quality, but preferably in same size of 4.00 x 6, to mount on the stock plastic rim.

Saw one here in Amazon, but looks same the stock  Marathon tire except price is slightly more.
My present tire is given at link (1) below:

(1)
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000VEJO2K/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o06_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1




This link (2) below looks to be slightly more expensive and has a good review from an ultralight pilot.

(2)
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001OKBFJ0/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&psc=1

I would like to keep the same width of 4 inches per tire, so I can use same axle and struts without modification.

Not sure if quality of (2) is better than (1) or not: ( Sometimes quality is as bad, just that the second seller is simply charging more ).
Anyways I have ordered a pair of (2).



Attachment: flat_tire_6567.jpg
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wirsig
November 22, 2018, 2:21am Report to Moderator

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It mounts on the same rim. I have it mounted in the picture linked above.
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