I've got a V-Max fuselage, main gear, and wing ribs, and I was considering buying the tail, wing kit, hardware kit, fabric kit, and plans (I only have the builder's manual). Are these kits really worth it, orcan I save a substantial amount of money by sourcing the parts myself, without adding too much to the difficulty? This is my first build.
I've been involved with a bunch of projects and in general have come to the conclusion that a reputable kit company, like lets say one that you would be getting Max kits from, earns their profit margin. And probably if you took the time to research it, I bet you would find more completions in the kit category than in the true stick built category, in both categories the percentage of completions by first buyer is remarkably small and eventual completions are not an awful lot better. The answer for any given builder also is a factor of what they are really doing the project for. Many would argue that builders rather build than fly, and within that group, the hours of construction compared to the hours of flying the project, bear that out. I put way over 5000 hours into one project and flew it 100 hours before encountering a snow bank in a white out, and people thought I was doing well at the 50 hours per year rate. And with a wooden plane, there is an additional skill set to consider, that of wood selecting which you would do in a stick built but not in a kit program. I focus mostly on wood planes but never wanted to go to the time and trouble of learning wood grading and selecting so for me it always ended up with the kit approach. I would suggest you consider one sub-kit at a time, then if you discontinue your build, which almost everyone does, your wallet doesn't get hurt too badly. Hope I have helped, good luck to you whichever way you go. Kim Brown
I bought the tail starter kit from Team. It was a great kit the wood was good stuff and it had the hinges. I started it but for some unexplained reason the ultra-piet kept calling to me. That and I found a great source of douglas fir. I can tell you for a fact that had i gone the kit minimax route I'd be flying by now. When i started I didn't think about all the metal brackets and bits I'd have to source/fabricate to keep moving. I am glad i went plans built now because it made me do a lot of problem solving and sourcing but the kit would have been easier. you have to ask yourself do you like to build, if so then continue if not find a flying plane then ask yourself if you like to scrounge if so then plans build if not get the kits. also make sure you have the tools and resources to scratch build. I have access to an aviation shop and can piggy back ACS orders with theirs to save on shipping. I also have a friend that can make anything out of metal who has helped a lot. both kit and plans building is something you can do just have to make sure you want to.
Look at the END Goal.....an aircraft you can own and fly.......if you can afford the kit...do it...if you can afford the part kits...JUST do it.
Its a good journey...others will support my thoughts....we are ALL on a budget...just ask the lady of the house...bloody airplanes..LOL
ohh this is not a Nike add.
Just do it with a focus on the end goal....and also imagine the color scheme..it helps. The support through this group is amazing....and you can do it...if you decide.
Which ever way you go it takes a huge commitment of effort to see it through to the finished product. I built from the individual parts kits; the size of the shop being a constraint. It is a little more expensive to do it this way but you can build the easily stored structures first and it helps with the work shop clutter. One of the things that can make or brake a project can be the amount of time it takes away from family life. I tried to continue the family activities the same way as before I began the build and this makes the build go a lot slower. If you add the selection and sourcing of raw materials to the time it takes to build you will have to be a very patient builder. The least expensive way would be to find the best example of what you want to build that is for sale and go buy it.
Good "onya" Bruce...well said. The Family stuff is also important..I forgot to mention That....every thing is a Balance...some where around she that must be obeyed...its called the C of G...LOL
Firstly (is that a word?), if you like building stuff you should build stuff if you have time and money. If you like airplanes and you like building stuff you should consider building model airplanes. If you like building stuff and like flying in airplanes you should consider building a full size airplane. If you don't like building stuff then you should not build stuff. If you don't like building stuff but you do like flying in airplanes then you should buy an airplane if you can afford one. If you can't afford to buy an EAB airplane then you can't afford to build one because in general EAB's sell at best for the price of materials and in a number of select cases for far less than the cost of materials. (EAB = Experimental Amateur Built)
But none of that directly addresses your question of if the kits are worth it. So:
Kit manufacturers are in the position that they have set up jigs and fixtures and tooling to produce parts in a fraction of the time that individuals could set up and produce the same parts. They can, for example, produce 10 parts in the time that you can produce one. They may earn 50 dollars an hour (but more likely they are earning half of that or so, given the economics of toys) making these parts but since it would take you ten times as long you can pay them 50 dollars labor plus their cost of raw materials for a part that took them an hour to build or you can build it yourself for (almost) the same cost of raw materials and spend 10 hours instead of 50 dollars and basically earn $5 per hour. Basically, the kit producers have invested in a "setup" the cost of which is shared among many buyers and they all enjoy an "economy of scale". If price is the ultimate concern and you can save money by doing it all yourself, but your hourly rate may be far less than "minimum wage". So what I am saying here is that, yes, the money spent on most kits is well worth it if you are at all concerned about the value of your time. Some may not put a value on their time. They are not wrong (unless like me they are old).
Now in the case of the Mini max the kit is primarily lumber that is already cut, ripped, or planed to size in two dimensions. If you have tooling for doing that and have a source for pretty good lumber then you can produce what they call a kit pretty easily. There is not that much fixtures and tooling in the case of minimax kits (with no to few finished parts) to generate an economy of scale. If you are not in a position to locate, select, rip and/or plane lumber to dimension then the kit is probably what you should look at because they do this for you.
In any case the minimax line is a "budget" or "shoestring" line at its heart and the prices charged by TEAM are pretty modest. If you enjoy flying and are seeking an enjoyable, reliable, really fun, and affordable plane then the minimax line, kit or scratch or finished and used, is about as good of a choice as you can make - IMHO
If you shop around on Barnstormers, with some luck you may find a partly finished project (from an original MiniMax kit sold by TEAM), for less than half the price of a full kit, with the sweetener that some parts of the airframe may already be built. Such abandoned / half-done projects may not contain every part required to wrap-up the build, but you will find many goodies in pre-cut wood, hardware and accessories required to complete the project. Just another tempting option to save both time and money.
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