Is anyone else out there scratch building or has scratch built? I have had good luck sourcing wood from local lumber yards (by being patient and taking time). Northern white pine is not difficult to find. As long as there is an understanding of AC 43.13-1B , etc... I have been able to source, grade and create RS10, RS17 and RS15 so far.

Some more thoughts -
I think scratch building looses its cost effectiveness from an aircraft parts supplier after you consider shipping costs etc. The only real way to save money is to grade the wood yourself from somewhere it is very affordable. Otherwise just get the kit, which will cost less than scratch building with parts from wicks or the like. Anyone else have experience with that?

I am finishing up the Empennage right now.  I may just buy the fuselage kit from team next to save time. Things like gusset 1.5 mm plywood are a little hard to come by.  Also - I would not be comfortable substituting any metal other than army navy standard.


    

I think the "kit" is a big ole box of wood,  well mostly.  So we are all scratch builders.
My experience scratch building, including shipping, saves about 50% over kit. My .02cents.

Thanks for chiming in! What supplier did you go through for that?

Lowe's white pine. P.P. AND L.P. or Idaho pine. I am trying to attach photos for you all.

Quoted from flydog

My experience scratch building, including shipping, saves about 50% over kit. My .02cents.

I would strongly disagree. From my experience a kit would have saved me a bundle. Unless you live close to Wicks or Aircraft Spruce or some other aircraft supply company, the only supplies you will find locally is the white pine. And you will have to know how to properly grade and select the appropriate lumber suitable for aircraft construction. You will spend a lot of time digging through piles of lumber only to find a few useable boards. About a third of those boards will be unusable as you will have to rip useable pieces of wood stock from it while avoiding the knots and arranging your cuts for suitable grain orientation. Which while we are on the subject of milling lumber, you will need a decent table saw to rip the lumber up, which that alone will cost you more than the shipping cost of a kit. Which brings us back around to shipping cost. anything over 4 foot long will almost triple in shipping cost. Don't believe me? Go to Aircraft Spruce and put a 3 foot piece of aluminum tubing in your kart and check the shipping cost. Then change it to a 5 foot piece of tubing and watch the shipping cost almost triple in price. And there are a lot of materials you are going to need that are over 4 foot long that you cant get from your local hardware store. When I was building mine, I drove from Florida to Wicks Aircraft in Illinois to pick up 2 4x8 sheets of 1/8" mahogany plywood because it was cheaper than the $400 dollars they wanted to ship it! And that's including fuel cost, 2 nights stay in a motel room, and food along the way. So I probably spent enough in shipping alone to pay for the biggest part of a kit.

No... If I had it to do over again, I would definitely buy a kit. It would be worth it if for no other reason than having everything I need to build the airplane right there, on hand, and ready to go. No hunting, no digging, no guess work, and no waiting for a shipment.

I also think it is good to go thru TEAM cause I want to keep them in business. The Max is a very good design and David is a good source of information about the aircraft but if he has to go out of business it would not be a good thing for us. But I also respect your right to make your own choice. Best wishes for a great build and happy flying when you finish your new flying machine.

Great! Ponderosa pine and lodgepole pine are fine and my older plans say to use ponderosa pine.  Menards has been carrying some good lumber as well scots pine from Ilim Timber...They also have some eastern white pine.  I've found many boards in the 2x4 and 2x6 no2 grade out in the yard.  With some effort I have found some very clear boards.  Finding good wood is part of the fun for me.  All the wood I've tested more than exceeds strength requirement.  Lowes also has white fir that is also suitable.  Unfortunately my phone will not upload the pictures of the wood I'm finding. Anyway, good luck and have a great time...I start this spring cutting wood.  Fyi...I pin the wood on both ends with a 3/8 piece of rebar since most of it is flat sawn.  I stack it with spacers as well.  I got the idea of pinning the wood from OSHA approved wood scaffolding boards that are pinned to keep them straight.

I'm building a Himax in Melbourne Australia and am sourcing and selecting my own timber. the cost of shipping timber (and the headaches of getting it through customs) made me decide to source it here.

I'm looking at buying the metal bits and bobs now.

one thing about the cost of scratch building is that you don't have to drop a large chunk of cash at once.

When I scratch build I do not go scrounging Home depot for lumber, I like to use ACS.
Couple mouse clicks and its on my doorstep.
Toliver, I just put two pieces of 1/8X4X8 mahog ply in my basket at ACS, put in a florida zip code and they are showing $172 for shipping. Don't know why they quoted you $400

Then just for fun, I plugged in the material to make a Minimax 1600 "wing kit", all from the plans material list, including freight to my location ( Mass), =$1305.
Team wing kit does NOT include the ribs. I get $2352 for a wing and rib kit and that does NOT include shipping.
IF Team charges the same $179 for shipping that ACS does, just a WAG, that gives me a 50% savings by scratch building.
Of course I do not want to see Team go out of business but if they choose to sell "plans only" its OK for me to shop around for a better price.

Scratch building vs. Kit building boils down to trading time for money. I scratch built and spent a lot of time, but not a lot of money. I have less invested in my MiniMAX, completed, with a engine I refreshed myself, new instruments, sitting in front of my hanger than a kit would have cost that didn't include engine or instruments.

Yes, TEAM MiniMAX needs to be supported to continue to benefit and be a resource for all, so I bought hardware, instruments and other items from TEAM to support them.

Lynn

Quoted from flydog

Toliver, I just put two pieces of 1/8X4X8 mahog ply in my basket at ACS, put in a florida zip code and they are showing $172 for shipping. Don't know why they quoted you $400

That was 22 years ago and it was $400 for truck shipping from Wicks. ACS was higher. Just checked ACS myself and it was $200.73  for LTL freight, whatever that is, they didn't offer it back then. I could still drive to Ohio and back again for way less than 200 dollars.

I know for a fact it cost me more to scratch build than a kit would have cost and I have the receipts to prove it. And that includes sourcing the northern white pine locally. But there are a lot of supplies you will have to order and pay shipping on and the shipping will eat you alive. The only advantage to scratch building is not having to fork over $6745 all at once. And the wing kit includes the material for the ribs by the way.

I am scratch building my piet and so far have come way under the cost of a max kit, I know apples to oranges but kind of similar, most of my wood is douglas fir flooring, with spruce being used for the smaller parts and the ribs, shipping on the smaller parts hasn't been that much, but shipping the aluminum tubes i need has been pricey. The biggest advantage for me though has been the self financing i can do. save a little plan the next project and order what i need while working on the current part.

Quoted from cdlwingnut

The biggest advantage for me though has been the self financing i can do. save a little plan the next project and order what i need while working on the current part.

That's what I did. Worked out well enough for me. Was more expensive in the end but I couldn't afford the price of a kit up front back then.

Where are you getting you plywood?

Quoted from toliver66

That's what I did. Worked out well enough for me. Was more expensive in the end but I couldn't afford the price of a kit up front back then.

Where are you getting you plywood?

the 1.5 mm is from ACS, all the 1/8" and 1/4" is baltic birtch that a local lumber yard ordered for me, very good stuff fraction of the cost of ACS. The baltic birtch comes in 5ft x 5ft sheets.