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E10 fuel  for Vintage Rotax 277 Doable?  This thread currently has 775 views. Print
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Phil
November 3, 2018, 7:11pm Report to Moderator

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We have only two reputable refineries to choose in our country.
In our local gas stations, Petron has more turn over than Shell.
Definitely will take Petron's Unleaded 91 RON to ensure fuel freshness
to be blend with their synthetic 2T product.



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TreeTopsTom
November 3, 2018, 10:05pm Report to Moderator

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My 02 cents. E-10 = BAD.
As mentioned many times here...
Probably the biggest problem is that it amounts to being a solvent. So while it does  a real good job of cleaning up the varnish & eating away at anything that cannot stand up to it, It is going to clog up your fuel system in short order. With that in mind...If you have a brand new engine and know that all the fuel system components are engineered to hold up to E-10, I think you would be fine running it.
Also as mentioned, Ethanol attracts water. So also as mentioned, Since these tanks are vented to atmosphere, Gallon for gallon, time span for time span, Your tank of Ethanol will tend to have water in it more so than a non Ethanol tank of gas.
To my knowledge, Those are probably the only 2 problems with the Ethanol fuels you should encounter. Unless we are going to get into other (highly technical) issues. Those are the BIG issues.
Though, if it has not been discussed, I would be interested in opinions about what I said about "New Engines" that are not coated with varnish AND have been designed with proper materials for the tanks, o-rings, fuel lines, fuel pump diaphragms...  
IE: If the engine is NEWER it (likely/hopefully) has been designed with Ethanol fuel use in mind. I'm sure this would be mentioned in the operators manual.
Since this thread drifter to LL fuel, I think it was all mostly covered why it's NOT recommended. Though I have heard if "in a pinch" you had to run a tank full of it, You can probably do so without immediate problems. IE: It takes some time for the lead to build up to cause any of the problems talked about.
IE: You can't run it all the time. But I don't believe ONE tank full (5 or 10 gallons) will cause your engine to quit on you or do any damage. Though I would pull the plugs after any such flight just to see if there is any evidence of build-up.    Again, only .02 cents worth.                                             TTT      
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Stilson
November 3, 2018, 11:53pm Report to Moderator
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Since ethanol has been around for a long time, I'd guess most components made in the last 10 years plus would probably be okay.  Long ago when it first started showing up at the gas stations around my area it did get a bad reputation because people switched over "cold turkey" to it because it was a lot cheaper and the old cars people were driving had years and years of varnish in the fuel system that quickly broke loose and plugged their filters , jets, and or injectors.  It wasn't the fuel system components failing but all the crud that had built up in it getting broke loose at once.  I've got over 100,000 miles driving experience in old cars, a 1947 chevy, a 1972 Cadillac, 76 ford, 79 Pontiac, and 79 Harley that the only "conversion" performed was SLOWLY switching them over to ethanol.  Starting with a gallon a tank full and slowly working up to let its solvent action dissolve the crud instead of breaking it loose in flakes.
But it will eventually  collect water if it sits to long, though in the 20 gallon car tanks I've found a 5 gallon can of fresh HIGH ethanol puts it right back in suspension after a couple hours sitting and it runs  like it was never there.
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Phil
November 4, 2018, 11:16am Report to Moderator

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Through this thread,  seems clear to me what should be done
Thank you guys. It gave confidence and piece of mind.
Best Regards,
Phil
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Phil
June 19, 2019, 10:29pm Report to Moderator

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One more question guys. Our Gasoline station has following products available where all labeled  E10. It has a minimum RON of 98, 95, 81. Does it mean this gasoline had no lead contain on it?
Thanks,
Phil
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radfordc
June 20, 2019, 1:27pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Phil

Our area has 91, 95, 98 octane in 10% ethanol.

Rotax reccomends a minimum of 90 octane unleaded.
Not sure which octane rating shoulld I used for break-in.
Any thought?

Regards,
Phil


Rotax recommends 90 octane using the European system...which is the same as 87 octane in the USA.  Any gas 87 and above is OK for breakin and normal running.  If you buy gas with a higher octane than required it doesn't hurt the engine...only the billfold.
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radfordc
June 20, 2019, 1:28pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from ScottLuckman

How to clean ethanol out of your Gas:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=onCG7mIprfE

That's my 2 cents for today!
Scott
A&P Mechanic


Ethanol is an octane booster so if you remove the alcohol from the gas the octane will be lower.  Not advisable for an aircraft engine.  In the video he says he will add octane booster back into the gas when he's done removing the alcohol.  Octane boosters are usually alcohol!

https://www.knowyourparts.com/.....e-ratings-explained/
"Ethanol is also a popular ingredient in octane boosters, because on its own, ethanol already has a very high octane rating (roughly 110)."
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Phil
June 21, 2019, 12:54am Report to Moderator

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Thanks for the info. Is it safe to say,  gas with 10% ethanol has no lead content to boost octane in the process? Just wondering.
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radfordc
June 21, 2019, 3:09am Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Phil




Thanks for the info. Is it safe to say,  gas with 10% ethanol has no lead content to boast octane in the process? Just wondering.


Unleaded fuel does not contain lead.
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PUFF
June 21, 2019, 11:47am Report to Moderator

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Where's our oil Driller....... Hey Termite!
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texasbuzzard
June 21, 2019, 12:13pm Report to Moderator

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blended fuels that most of us use now will eventually effect the rubber seals that are still being used on our engines and our fuel system. factory rotax seals are rubber that means you will have to replace them sooner than expected. many seals now are being made out of Viton which seems to stand up to ethanol.

monte
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Phil
June 21, 2019, 12:53pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Phil




Thanks for the info. Is it safe to say,  gas with 10% ethanol has no lead content to boost octane in the process? Just wondering.


Oh yes, got the answer..



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ETLB Squawk Forums    Building and Flying Related Boards    miniMax, Hi-Max, and AirBike General Discussions  ›  E10 fuel  for Vintage Rotax 277 Doable?

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